During the period modelled, Great Western passengers travelling on the Metropolitan lines had the use of 4-wheel carriages originally designed by James Holden, the Carriage and Wagon Superintendent and chief assistant to William Dean. Various diagrams to his design were built over many years, even after he’d gone on to greater things as the Locomotive, Carriage and Wagon Superintendent of the GER in 1885.
Photographs of these carriages on Metropolitan duties in the period Basilica Fields is set have been difficult to come by (suggestions please!), so I’ve had to make do with this lovely photo taken at Paddington c1910.
I will be running a couple of rakes of Holden carriages of this type. One will represent Middle Circle Set No.4 as running between 1889 – c1896 (after pestering Graham Beare, and he John Lewis with a multitude of questions, sufficient information has come to hand to extrapolate the numbers in the set during those years), and a second set formed as one might have been seen c1897-1905. Unfortunately the historical record is much soupier with this later period, so unless further evidence comes to light, the running numbers will be largely “best guesstimate”.
In a later post I’ll explore the formation of the two sets and their duties which will lead to a more comprehensive article on the main site when that’s up and running, and I’ll also detail the build of the sets using Roxey Mouldings kits and my own etches.
April 1, 2010 at 7:39 pm
Let us not forget the assistance given by David Hyde when I spoke to him in March 2009. David was able to resolve several of my queries about the origin of the lot details and notes which were available to Jack Slinn and David when they produced the original historical details for the Roxey Mouldings instructions (and, it seems, the source of all other references to the Victorian and Edwardian ML&C and Gas Sets since then). At the time when Jack produced his photo folders for the HMRS the only source of information relating to the lots and uses of the four wheel coaches originated with Blissard Barnes in the mid 1950s. The Blissard Barnes archive together with Jack Slinn’s photo folders are thought to be with the HMRS at the Butterley Centre.
regards, Graham
April 2, 2010 at 1:06 am
Thanks for reminding me of, and highlighting David’s input.
May 21, 2010 at 5:59 pm
Holden coaches… Arc roof… Wake up there please.
May 23, 2010 at 1:24 am
Brilliant, and I’m now wide awake!
For the benefit of other readers, Graham recently sent me a photo of a rusticated post-1887 Middle Circle carriage with round-topped doors and a high single-arc roof profile (as opposed to a low single arc profile as per the early 1880s close-coupled stock with square-topped doors). I responded by saying that I thought it was the first instance I’d seen such a roof on these carriages, as all other photos and diagrams I have here show a three-arc profile with a near-flat centre; but lo and behold, here was one right under my nose all along.
It just goes to show that that you can become so familiar with an image that you can miss the most obvious of details.
Now I need to ascertain which Diagrams or Lots carried the different profiles!
May 23, 2010 at 1:31 pm
How about starting with the end view of the possible coach diagrams?
So do you now feel that you might include the coach at Rodwell as that is a superb photo with lots of contemporary features????
regards, Graham
May 23, 2010 at 9:19 pm
I’ve checked all the diagrams that I have: R5, S17, S18, T5, T6, T7, T8, T59 & U6. All have the 3-arc flat top roof profile.
The option for including it was always there, providing I (we) đŸ˜‰ can make a reasonable stab at trying to ascertain which diagram it is, and which other carriage diagrams it might have run with in a set on Middle Circle services.
January 13, 2017 at 5:00 pm
ianjhopkins24@gmail.com I am building the proposed LSWR terminus at South Kensington in 1885. Do you have a drawing of one of the GWR Holden arc roofed brake thirds. I will be using it as a ‘scenic blocker’ to hide the District Railway platform on the layout